From the brink of divorce to true connection: the ultimate relationship comeback – Pesa Shayo

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You have already transferred your loyalty from the family of origin to your new family. You can say, you know what sister, I see what you mean. Let me see, let me talk to my husband first and then we will tell you, we will decide. Now that to some people right now listening are saying, are you kidding me?

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There is no way I'll do that. That's why you're causing a lot of these problems. Because now once your wife or once your husband finds out later, there will be a lot of resentment. Like you took money that we were supposed to use for our family. gave it to her, to your sister, or gave it to your parents without even letting me know, giving me the courtesy of letting know that this is happening. So once they find out later, there will be a lot of distrust and animosity.

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Welcome back to Becoming with Precious. The broadcast here we honor the journey of unfinished people navigating pivots, reinvention and the massive presence of self-becoming. Today we have Pesachayo with us. Pesachayo is an author and the co-founder of live your best marriage. It specializes in helping cross-cultural Christian couples build a united front against in-law pressure, loyalty conflicts and cultural clashes. Today, we are diving into a real conversation about how a personal marriage crisis completely shifted its approach to family and leadership. Professor, welcome to the show.

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Thank you very much Precious and I'm very happy to be here with you today. It's good to have you, Pesha. To get us started, who are you and what are you currently? I want you to tell us a bit about your background and the work you are focused on right now.

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I'm Pesa Shayo and originally I'm from Kenya and at the moment I live in the United States and through those I've been married to my wife Whitney for about 20 years and we have four daughters. and the reason why we ended up founding Live Your Best Marriage was a lot of problems that we were dealing with in our marriage. And just as the name of your podcast says, we ended up at the lowest point of our marriage did not really end our story. It actually exposed what we needed to become and eventually gave birth to the ministry that we are doing right now.

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Wow, that's beautiful Pesa. So let us jump straight into the turning point of your story. You went through a marriage crisis that exposed a difficult reality. So can you walk us through the moment you realized there was a massive gap between the husband you taught you here and the husband your family actually needed.

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Thank you, you know I was raised in a place where men believed that all you had to do when you were taking care of your family was making sure that you are providing for them financially. So growing up i would see my father, my cousin, my uncles they were very hard working and they were very prosperous and they viewed themselves as great husbands and great dads because of one thing, the fact that they could provide. So seeing that I brought that with me into my marriage and as long as I was always working and I was always making sure that my family is taking care of financially,

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I believed I was a good husband but at the same time through this whole thing my wife was not and the relationship between your family and your wife. And I think that's something that we are not, we were not connecting. She was raised in a place where not only do you need to provide, but also the emotional connection was very important.

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And that is something that not only did I, I didn't know it was needed, I didn't even know it existed. So just for my being raised, and live your family or your wife. So through this whole thing, my wife was measuring me. I was measuring myself all the time by my effort but she was living the impact of not being available to her.

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And one thing also at that time, I was not… She brought this up to me but I guess I was hard-headed. I was very defensive and I viewed her as she was not being grateful instead of listening that oh you know, I feel alone here. I feel like you are not home.

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I felt like, how dare you? You are so ungrateful to me. And this went on for a while but one day she, the crisis was she was wanting to have a divorce. And thank God I listened because at that moment I realized just because my intentions are good does not mean other people are, the effects of quote-unquote my good intentions are good to other people.

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So I had to stop pause and realize that I have to change And that sounds easy right now, but at that time it was a very big crisis Thank you for sharing that with us This is a common thing that happens in most homes today So yeah, coming face-to-face with that gap takes a lot of vulnerability What was the audacious move you had to make to rebuild your foundation And bridge that divide between you and your wife.

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point out how wrong they were and how they are they are taking advantage of me or things like that. So I had to learn to, number one, stop being defensive and listening and then having these honest conversations knowing that yes, I want to say you're not perfect too, you're not perfect either but that never worked for me because I've used it for so many years and it still Alright, so on this show we love to talk about the messy reality of growth. So some of the challenges you faced during that period while you were trying to fix things, and how did

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you overcome them? Okay, so one of the biggest challenges at that time was the fact that it was very hard to find a man like me who I can talk to. And what I mean is I had a lot of friends and I had surrounded myself with a lot of friends but to see we were doing the same thing.

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We all believed the only way to be a great husband is work, never be at home and provide. So me going and telling them that I'm going through a hard time, they really did not understand. And some of them at that time were even telling me you know what?

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You chose the wrong woman. You choose the wrong… If you only had the right one, you will be having this problem. If you only had somebody who really understands what you are going through, then you won't have this problem. So anyways, at that time my biggest problem is my circle of friends, I could not go to and

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Thank you for sharing that with us. So let's talk about, you know, that season led you to create the Live Your Best Marriage. So how did you translate your own relationship struggles into a practical framework that ebbs other couples? Thank you so it was at that it took a while before I was able and I was able to translate my framework, like my struggles into a framework.

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And what helped me was start going and continuing seeing a lot of my friends doing the same things I used to do. And it's like they are having a lot of problems within their marriages by that time but were not able to communicate well and also connect well with their wives.

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So that's where everything started. and helping them slowly by slowly. And then start realizing, you know what? There's a lot of guys just like me who still believe in the old ways of you don't have to be emotionally connected. You don't have to be having a united front.

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We call it a united front, you and your wife. And I also found out, especially when we are dealing with a cross-cultural couple, one person coming from a different country, they might be bringing a totally different way of viewing life. And there's a lot of assumptions. They are assuming that that's how everybody sees life.

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So that was something that just with my problems, with some of my difficulties I was able to use to create my framework. Just as an example, I had a situation going on in my life where growing up naming I am a child, we were used, culturally, we were naming children after our grandparents.

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So you name them after your grandparents, grandfather or grandmother and like that. But my wife came from a place where because you are the mother and you went through the pregnancy You are supposed to name the child. That was a very different culture and practice. Yes, so I'm here me and my family, my family of origin. We are waiting to name the child And my wife is shocked like how what do you mean? Name the child I am the mom. I'm the one who went through the pregnancy I'm the one who's naming the child

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So that needed compromise So we ended up we ended up compromising because my side of the family was not giving up And she wasn't giving up either So we ended up coming up with a way to compromise. She chose the first name, we chose the second name and then the last name is the son name, the family name but sounds very easy now But at that time it was such a big problem. Nobody was wanting to let go of what lived as The Right Thing To Do. Yeah, that's very relatable. It's actually a common practice in

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every society as cross-cultural marriages. So you know, you see that many cross-cultural couples, they turn on each other without realizing the true source of their attention. So how do you help spouses see that the real problem is outside pressure like family expectations and rather than a lack of love.

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Thank you, thank you. You know when you are getting married there is a lot of love and belief that as long as we are loving each other everything will be okay. What the problem happens is as you're going through your marriage what we call it a loyalty transfer and loyalty transfer especially for people who come from cultures where it's what we call a collective culture Everything is done together as a culture, as a family. So being able to transfer loyalty from your family of origin to your new family that was where a lot of problems happened because yes the cross-cultural couple are

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married but either their husband or their wife still believes that their family of origin is where their loyalty remains. Yeah. So if their mother or their father or their uncle calls them, they are willing to make a decision with them that might even affect their new family without even taking consideration what does my wife or what does my husband think about this?

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So it's very important to realize that okay now I have a new family, I'm going to transfer my loyalty to the new one. But not not but also at the same time I'm not saying that you should now start disrespecting your family of origin. You are still honoring your mother and father as the commandment in the Bible says, honor your mother and father. Yes, you're still honoring them but because now you've started a new family which is you left and cleaved which basically two became one. Now because Those two have become one, you are respecting that. And how this happens in real life, let's

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say you are in a WhatsApp group, and in the WhatsApp group you are with your sisters. And with your sister, they say, you know what, can you lend us some money? Most people will not even think twice before saying, you know what sister, I have some money, take some money. But if you are going with, you have already transferred your loyalty from the family of origin to your new family, you can say, you know what sister, I see what you mean, me talk to my husband first and then we will tell you, we will decide. Now, that to some

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people right now listening are saying, are you kidding me? There is no way I'll do that. Yeah. That's why we're having a lot of these problems because now once your wife or once your husband finds out later there will be a lot of resentment like you took money that we were supposed to use for our family gave it to her, to your sister or give it to your parents without even letting me know giving me the courtesy of letting know that this is happening so once Once they find out later, there will be a lot of distrust and animosity. So just to simplify

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everything, a lot of problems would happen if we haven't transferred loyalty from our family of origin to our new home we are building. All right so that's a great answer but I've seen that certain boundaries within laws is incredibly tough especially in cultures that evenly emphasize honoring parents.

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So, how can Christian couples protect their marriage unity without crossing the line into disrespect? Yes. And thank you very much. That's a very important question because I've dealt with it many times. I always say, and this came after many years of dealing with in-laws. I love my in-laws.

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They love me. We have no problems. But one thing I realized was in-laws problems is not a problem. laws problems is what we call a symptom of the problem. The problem is you and your wife or you and your husband are not united. So that's why are able to come in and make separate the two of you. Let me give an example, let's say my wife is talking to her father so the father-in-law, my father-in-law and he decides, he asks hey I am planning to come to visit you, I have no problem with that but let's say one day I come from work

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and I just find him in the house and he's gonna stay there for a whole week. I'll be saying, hold on what's going on? How come nobody told me this? And now that sounds like a really crazy example but it happens all the time. Yeah. Somebody will say, nobody told me your parents is coming to stay here for a week and at that time you are seen as the problem because you are refusing for my dad or for the parent to come and stay. But I think the best thing is to let them know ahead of time

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and especially when it comes to money. Money is always a problem, either lending money or going and getting loans. And we found that once you are taking loans, it's very hard to set a boundary because we had a case where the father-in-law helped a couple buy a house so they basically paid more than half of their house. Now they were insisting that they need to change their roof.

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The husband is saying no, I'm not ready to change this roof but the father-in-law paid for that house half of the house so he's trying to protect his investment. Yeah. So it's hard when it comes to boundaries yes you it's good to set boundaries but also realize that boundaries are will show that are you united in the first place and also don't do things which will make it harder to set boundaries, like always taking loans.

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Alright so for the listener office they are constantly competing with their in-laws for their spouse loyalty. What is one practical step they can take this week to start facing that prejo as one united team? Okay I will tell them that they need to address this issue with their spouse. They need to let Let them know, okay this is what's going on.

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Now that does not mean it will go great the first time they address it but it's very important for you to let them know like okay this is what's happening I feel like I'm second, I'm playing second to your family every time we go to visit them maybe they're always making jokes about me or they are just saying oh you are from another country or this I feel I feel like, or even when they come to visit, I feel like I don't even belong in my own house.

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Make it clear you are just expressing your side of the story which is this is how I feel. Can we address this issue? And mostly most people will think it's about stopping the in-laws from saying those things but we believe it's about your husband sticking with you. If they can say, you know what, this is my wife do not talk to her like that.

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The same way I wouldn't want anybody to talk to my mom that way. I think that will make it more easier for them to stop. Alright, that's a great answer Pesa. Thank you so much for sharing so much insights with us on this show. With all the personal and professional evolution that you have experienced on this journey, what are you currently becoming?

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And what does the concept of becoming mean to you today? Thank you. What I'm currently becoming is a husband who is aligned and when I mean aligned is what he's saying, what he's saying outside the family, outside the house is the same thing that his kids and his wife are experiencing in the home. What I mean if I'm telling people pray I'm also expected to be praying at home too. Yeah so I want to make sure that those two sides What my kids experience and what my wife experiences is what I'm telling other people out in the wild.

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So there's not two different people, no it's the same person and that's what I'm becoming. That's a beautiful Pesa. Your transparency today has been so valuable. So here can our listeners go to take your free three minutes United Front marriage audit and connect with your resources. And also for those who want to reach out to you online and connect with you, here is the best place for them to go. Thank you so far we have the free United Front audit and they can always get it at Live Your Best Marriage. Live Your Best Marriage is L-I-V-E

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U-R-BestMarriage.com and there will be a button there to click to do to take the free United Front quiz. And the quiz is less than three minutes and what it does, it will show you where you are loyalty and where you're having problems in your marriage and that's where you'll know where to need to start solving the problems. Also if you're on Instagram you can always find us at Live Your Best Marriage and we send memes there every day several times a day and also you can always and send me a DM on Instagram.