Podcast appearance
United, Not Divided: Marriage, Faith, Pressure, and Standing Together with Pesa Shayo
Victory Igberase talks with Pesa Shayo about marriage unity, family pressure, cultural differences, loyalty conflicts, faith, communication, and healthy boundaries.
- Podcast
- Born Without a Choice
- Host
- Victory Igberase
- Published
- Guest
- Pesa Shayo
Listen
Born Without a Choice
Episode overview
About this conversation
This episode begins with a practical premise: marriage requires more than love. Couples also need a shared way to respond when family expectations, cultural differences, or loyalty conflicts put pressure on the relationship.
Pesa explains how a United Front helps spouses stop fighting each other, strengthen communication, and set faith-rooted boundaries while continuing to honor the people around them.
Key takeaways
Marriage principles discussed
- Marriage unity is a practice, not merely a feeling.
- Family and cultural pressure should be faced as a shared challenge.
- Healthy boundaries protect the marriage without requiring disrespect.
- Clear communication reduces divided loyalties and unspoken resentment.
- Faith can provide a shared foundation for commitment and repair.
Chapters
Conversation chapters
Full transcript
Born Without a Choice transcript
Transcript note: Published with permission and formatted for readability. This transcript was automatically generated from the original public recording or caption track. Speaker names are omitted where the source did not identify them, and minor transcription errors may remain.
00:00Opening and Guest Introduction
Nobody asked to be here.
None of us chose the family we were born into,
the culture we inherited,
the traditions we were expected to follow,
or the beliefs that shaped our view of love and relationships.
But one day, many of us choose someone to build a life with
and suddenly two people aren't just joining hearts,
they are bringing together two families,
two cultures, two histories and sometimes two completely different worlds.
When outside pressure begins to grow, many couples are normally turned against each other instead of
standing together. So today's conversation is about unity, boundaries, communication
and learning how to protect your relationship when life tries to pull you apart.
Welcome to Born Without a Choice. Today's guest is Pesa Shayo
He's an author, co-founder of Live Your Best Marriage.
So Pesa helps cross-cultural Christians couples build what he calls a united front,
helping them navigate family expectations, in-law pressure, loyalty conflicts and cultural differences
without losing each other in the process.
Drawing from his own cross-cultural marriage with his wife.
Whitney and years of helping couples strengthen their relationship.
Pesa teaches that love isn't just about romance, it's about learning to stand together when
outside pressure rises. His message is simple but powerful. Couples don't have
to keep turning against each other. They can learn to face life challenges as one team.
So, Pesa, welcome to the show.
Thank you, thank you very much for having me.
Wonderful person.
So every relationship begins with two people, but often it feels like
two entire families are getting married.
So how has your own cross-cultural marriage shaped
your understanding of relationships?
Yes.
You know, I'm originally from Kenya and my wife is American
02:30Why Marriage Needs Unity
and we've been married for more than 20 years,
and we have four daughters.
And with that, just with going
with the understanding
that we are born without a choice,
I was basically,
we were not born with,
we did not choose which country
were born,
which culture we inherited,
the family patterns we grow up around
or the expectations of the people
that place on us.
But at some point,
we are now becoming, we need to become more responsible about what we do with what
we inherited. So from two different cultures, we might not have chosen what mindset we grew up
with but we are now choosing how we need to act at the present and also we are
responsible on how we're going to pass this to our kids and also to the people that God has
trusted us to influence.
Truly amazing perspective of one without a choice, wonderful basic.
So many couples don't realize outside pressure is actually the source of their conflicts.
So why do you think so many people end up blaming each other instead of recognizing
the real issue?
You know, I think we most of us, we are usually on autopilot.
We don't think, we don't stop to think what's really the issue that I'm dealing with.
Most of us have already been trained from where we came from on how to behave,
how to act, what's supposed to be a good thing, what's supposed to be a bad thing.
And coming from an African background,
I already had a strong mindset about what a good husband,
what they should do.
I knew they should be working hard.
They should pay, provide financially,
pay the bills and things like that.
But so even if we came to an argument,
I wasn't pausing and saying,
okay, does she have a point?
It was usually, yes, we have the pressure
but I just go on autopilot
and say, I am right,
I'm providing,
I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing,
then why is there a problem?
So instantly we start blaming
the other person instead of stopping and thinking, maybe she has a point.
Maybe I'm bringing a lot of information from where I came from
and I'm not able to see where she's coming from.
The same way, their wife might also be doing the same thing without even knowing.
05:30Family Pressure and Cultural Differences
So the pressure you might be dealing with constant pressures, but before you know,
you guys are attacking each other, not seeing that you are a team.
Yeah, I completely agree with that perspective.
And also, Pesa, in your pressure can quietly damage even healthy relationships.
So what's the biggest mistakes couples make when trying to balance marriage and family expectations?
That this is a hard one but because there's a lot of advice couples are getting.
There's one advice that says live and cleave which is
When you start a new family,
you should forget.
You should cleave, cut and forget your family of origin.
But this can be a very hard thing for people who are raised to respect their parents,
people who are raised to view that their family of origin also has a part
to play in their life.
So when the in-laws,
when one person thinks the in-laws should not have any point
in the conversation, while the other one thinks
the in-laws should be at the table.
Now that becomes a big problem because for most of the time
you're not really marrying one person.
You are also bringing together two families,
two cultures and two different ways
of handling conflicts and also two ways
of thinking about money,
two ways of thinking about raising children
and also two ways of just even showing respect.
And so underneath this whole thing,
the real question sometimes I like to ask is
will you choose your wife or will you choose your spouse
when their family of origins expectations are something else?
And we, when we talk about the United Front,
we talk about we are not here to dishonor your parents
or reject your culture, we are here to say, okay, if we are creating a family that is not governed by
your parents, by your fear, by your ego, by your work, but you're bringing two people together,
your wife and husband under Christ, and they will make decisions as a couple first before going
and accepting or bringing ideas from the in-laws.
So they make a decision first as a couple,
and that is a big one because most of us are trained to think
in terms of what did my mom want?
What does my dad think and things like that?
Yeah, definitely.
It's really coming for me by my Africa background
I sure can relate to that
because I'm from Nigeria
and you know, as Africans we have lots of traditions
09:00Boundaries and Loyalty Conflicts
and all that.
So it's definitely really difficult.
Yes, it's really difficult.
And when you give advice say like don't listen to your parents
that a lot of people will be like, hold on.
But they are the ones who help me get to where I am right now.
So that doesn't really work for a lot of people coming from cultures
like where they really respect their parents.
But if you can have a united front with your wife and then at the same time still honoring your parent,
you can have in a way both.
Definitely, Lisa.
So for young people preparing for future relationships, our importance is to have conversations
about family values, culture, and boundaries before marriage.
Yes.
What I'll tell younger?
people to do is, do not wait until you're married
to start becoming the kind of person your marriage will require.
What I mean is learn now to start taking responsibility,
learn how to communicate because sometimes we get into marriage
without even knowing how to communicate or listening.
And also at the moment, learn how to apologize,
especially if you're coming from a culture where men don't
apologize and learn now how to tell the truth without blaming somebody else,
which can be a really hard thing because sometimes it's just easy to blame than actually
really go down and find out what the truth. Because a lot of young,
a lot of us want love but at the same time we don't want to be mature through the whole relationship
and we don't want to take responsibility of some of the things that we are doing
to cause the problem in our marriage.
So, but if they start learning these things now,
they will also be able to get somebody who appreciates
this characters instead of just finding somebody
who doesn't really care about these things
and then they just go through years
of being forced to learn these things.
And also just to remember that you might not choose
where you are born, but you can always choose how you're going to build it from where you
are right now. Which is something very important. Definitely, definitely.
So Mason, sorry, so Pesa. Yes.
For listeners who aren't married yet, but hope to, you know, some need be,
what's one relationship lesson you wish everyone understood before saying I do?
I think the biggest relationship,
the biggest message is learn to take responsibility
of what you caused in the marriage.
12:30Communication and Faith
Be okay taking that responsibility
and don't drag this thing for years
because you cannot really take responsibility
of the things you did.
Truly wonderful and amazing answer
for my business is thinking about.
So, finally Pesa, if someone listening feels like
their relationship is constantly under pressure from family, culture or outside opinions,
what message would you leave them with today?
I will remind them they need to start with prayer
and they need to remember that
need to be a team with their spouse first because if you show your in-laws,
your extended family that fast, you don't make any decisions without consulting
your spouse.
After a while they'll start understanding but if both of you are always fighting each other
and you don't see each other as a team, you will always have these problems.
Definitely, definitely so please him.
Yes.
What lessons have you learned personally from your own marriage that has completely changed the way
you see, love and commitments?
My biggest lesson is, and this was not easy, was as a man paying bills
is not the same as making your wife or my wife feel that they are loved
or feel that they are chosen.
And also as a man, like working hard and making sure you are always working is not the same
as being emotionally present.
And also working so hard to be a great man in public but at home you are not a safe husband.
That's a lesson that I've learned that will not work in your marriage.
So one of the biggest standpoint for me was
I had to stop asking, am I providing enough?
Am I doing enough?
Am I picking enough shifts?
Am I providing enough and start asking,
does my wife actually feel that she's being loved or that she feels safe
or even being heard or chosen?
15:30Practical Closing Guidance
Because if she doesn't feel these things,
it doesn't matter how much you do
and how much money you bring home.
There is still going to be a disconnect.
Yeah, definitely.
So, at the end of the day, love isn't tested when everything is easy.
It's tested when pressure comes, when expectations collide,
when the voices around you become louder than the promises you've made to each other.
Yes.
The strongest relationships aren't built because two people never disagree.
They're built because two people choose again and again
to stand on the same side against the problem, not against each other.
Because the world may try to defy you, but unity is always a choice.
You're right.
Definitely.
This has born without a choice and our wonderful guest of the day, Pesa, it was truly a pleasure
to have you on the show.
And for anyone listening right now who this whole conversation I was recently with
and would love to learn more about you, where can they do that, Pesa?
Okay, they can always follow us at Instagram
at Live Your Best Marriage, which is L-I-V-E, your best marriage.
Or also they can go to liveyourbestmarriage.com.
Again, it's L-I-V-E, Your Best Marriage.com.
And I really enjoyed being here born without a choice podcast
because this is something that really resonates with me
where yes, I was born without a choice for a lot of things
but I can be responsible for what I pass down from now on to my family and to my kids.
Definitely, sir. Once again, truly a pleasure to have you on the show.
Thank you very much, sir.
Credits and links
About this podcast appearance
Born Without a Choice is hosted by Victory Igberase. This page remains connected to the original public episode.
Learn more about Pesa Shayo, explore his books, or see more podcast appearances. Marriage resources are available from Live Your Best Marriage.